frankly… Episode 59: Don’t be Afraid to Write in the Margins

In this episode of frankly…

The transcript below is AI-generated and may contain minor inaccuracies. Tune in to the episode audio to hear the full conversation! 

Transcript 

Rachel 

Hello. Welcome to Frankly. Welcome. Welcome. So today, we are talking with Scott Monti, who is an executive coach, advisor, public speaker, with his organization, Timeless Leadership. 

Dan 

 So Scott has an interesting background. He kind of walks us through it here in this interview, but, you know, from early beginnings in a vision of becoming a doctor through a career in communications that went from healthcare to automotive, agency to corporate, and now to his current role with Timeless Leadership. 

Rachel 

Yeah. I think you’ll hear him talk about Alan Mulally. He spent, you know, a good time at Ford, but Alan Mulally called him a visionary, and I really think that is so true. After listening to him talk, he’s got some see-in-the-future capabilities. 

Dan 

 And actually left companies who didn’t see it with him that probably kicked themselves on the other side of it. 

Rachel

Yeah. 

Dan 

So I mean, just super interesting. He’s been a strategic adviser for quite some time now in both leadership and communications, and he has clients like Walmart, IBM, McDonald’s, Coca Cola, Google, I mean, across the board, across companies, just a really insightful way of thinking and doing so. 

Rachel 

 Think you’ll enjoy this one. 

Dan 

Yeah. Hi, Scott, welcome to Frankly. 

Scott  

Hi Rachel. Hi, Dan. Nice to be here. Thanks for having me. 

Dan 

Absolutely. I want to start with your career. It’s a very cool career path. I think you’ve had some awesome experience that’s led you to where you’re. So tell us in in your words, I want to hear you talk about your background and career path that got you to your current role. 

Scott 

Well, it’s anything but a straight line. I think this is something that. Maybe when I started out I wasn’t exactly sure where it was going to go, but I never predicted it was going to be here. And to be truthful, I actually intended to be a doctor. A pediatrician, in fact. Yeah, I was pre Med as an undergrad. And as I was grappling for, you know, just filling my class schedule. The standard advisors like, well, you should be a bio or chem major if you’re pre Med. And I realized that you know what I’m going to get science at the wazoo for the rest of my academic career. And pre Med is just a concentration. Not. It’s not a major, so you can major in anything you want as long as you hit those prerequisite courses. And it was the first semester of my sophomore year I took a class. In Greek civilization, CL101 Classics 101 with Steve Esposito. And Steve was a professor like I had never had. He he was just just really down to Earth and swore in class and just brought these ancient stories to life in a way that no one ever had for me before. 

Speaker 

Check. 

Scott 

I thought this is pretty cool, right? So. I ended up choosing classics as a major ’cause. I could study history and drama and sports and architecture and all facets of human nature from the ancient times and see where their influences were today. So I ended up going to the first year of Med school. Decided that is not what I want to be doing. It was I I would have been a doctor if it wasn’t for the science thing. Let’s put it that way. 

Dan 

I feel that. 

Scott 

But I I love the human interaction. Taking the history, getting to know people, understanding their motivations, etcetera. So I ended up turning that first year of medical school into a Masters degree with a thesis, and I added an MBA. On top of that, with a concentration in healthcare administration and this was back when, you know managed care was first a big thing and it was uncertain where it was going to go. And I thought, well if if I’m in the business and I have a little bit. Scientific knowledge. Medical knowledge as well as business knowledge that might be a benefit. Well. You know what Healthcare is like. Let’s just say I got a big flat spot in the middle of my forehead from banging it against the wall so frequently, so I left there and went into consulting in biotech, medical device, and pharma. And helped early stage companies get financial and scientific partnerships to bring their technology to the market. And that was great. Until September 11th happened and the deal making market just. Completely imploded and it was a small family run consultancy, so they shut our division down. From there I went into advertising and marketing in healthcare and high tech discovered digital communications, digital marketing and what ended up becoming social media and tried to convince the agency at the time. That that was going to be the future. Didn’t see the business model. 

Dan 

I need to know. 

Speaker 

What? 

Dan 

I need to know what year this was. I feel like this is important. 

Scott 

This was 2005. 

Dan 

1. So and that’s. Early stages of even like, not even the traditional what we know today, social media.

Scott 

Very early. 

Dan 

You were on to something. 

Scott 

That’s exactly right back then. Facebook was only for people who were still in school, right? Had to have an Edu e-mail address at that point. 

Dan 

Yep. 

Scott 

And social media, as we then understood it. You know Web 2.0 as we were calling it was. Is corporate. Blogging was was the big thing back then and then ultimately YouTube and and then you know you you saw these other channels being added on but the the agency just didn’t get it. They didn’t understand what the business model was. And it it really crystallized in a client conversation. This was probably six months into podcasting actually being a thing. And we had a client that wanted to do some thought leadership but didn’t want to do the standard White paper. And I said. Well, how about hosting a podcast? You get to bring on interesting and intelligent. Talk with them about about issues that are germane to your industry and you look smart by virtue of having these other people on. You guys sensing a theme here? It’s it’s a good strategy. And the woman who was my client said, well, not really sure about that. You have a case study you can show us. And I pause for a moment. I said, you know. Whole phenomenon of podcasting is brand new. Do you want to? You want to read a case study, or do you want to be a case study? 

Rachel 

Yeah, this could be you exactly. 

Dan 

Oh, I love that way. You just said that. You want to read. 

Rachel 

Yeah. 

Dan 

Or be it and she goes. 

Scott 

I want to read a case study, yeah. 

Rachel 

It was a great concept though. Me that. 

Scott 

Yeah, well, you know, it took a few years to be proven out, but so I left. That agency went to work for a strategic consultancy that just did social media strategy for big brand. And there then I got a tap on the shoulder from Ford Motor Company. Though we are creating this new executive position to lead social media and digital communications globally, won’t you come out to Dearborn and have a look at, you know, kick the tires, so to speak? And I was back in Boston and I really. Had no inkling of what life in Detroit was like. I had no interest in in coming out here. Was nothing pulling me out here. And after some. Contracted. Eventually I came out for an interview and I was blown away. Blown away by the people, the company and the general sense that I got walking in the door there, there was something special going on at Ford Motor Company. In 2008. That’s that’s when I was brought out here and I joined in July of 2008, and the Carpocalypse started about 10 days after I started. 

Dan 

Interesting year. 

Rachel 

Yeah. 

Scott 

And I held on for dear life. Had a great. We had a great plan. We communicated clearly and we just led the way and I was there for six years. And really, paving the road behind us in what we did in social media at Ford, I left there and hung out my own shingle to do communications, consulting. And ultimately that has turned in the last couple of years into leadership consulting and coaching. Because. Fundamentally, leadership is about communication. But more and more what I’ve learned. Working with fantastic leaders along the way. Is that there are certain human traits, certain pieces of human nature, that are constant and that we look for in leaders, and I go all the way back now to my beginnings in classics, and I realized if I had only paid more attention in classes back then, I. Have been far ahead of the curve. Than I find myself today. 

Dan 

It’s such an interesting point that you make because. It you what? Were really interested in was classics. It’s really psychology. It’s the human psychology of why we do the things we do, why we make the choices that we make, why we communicate in the way that we do, and how each person is different. Things are innate. Things are innate, right? Like. You’re comparing it to classics, but it really like it comes down to that psychology. And I think as communicators, we all have a fascination. With psychology at a basic level, because you communicate in a certain way because you understand the psychology of your audiences, right? 

Scott 

But that’s exactly right. And you know it’s. It’s part psychology, it’s part sociology, it’s it’s part. History is part literature, right. 

Speaker 

That’s. 

Scott 

If you if. Pick apart any of these things. You end up seeing patterns and trends you understand. Particularly when you’ve seen something play out before. Not be exactly the same. Certainly not the same technology today as it was 200 or 2000 years ago, but that human interaction is the same. If you understand that from a fundamental level. You know. You can actually predict the future by understanding the past. 

Dan 

And you can prove it now with data. So like now we implement. Now we get to implement these things because we understand it. 

Scott 

Yes. 

Dan 

Then say look it. Or hey, this didn’t work because you can back it with that technology. So it’s that, like evolution of how we’ve gotten here, that makes us even smarter in communication marketing. 

Scott 

Yeah, exactly. 

Rachel 

So so now today at with timeless leadership talk a little bit about what your role looks. Because, you know, I think there’s still elements of communications in there, but there’s more than that right in your in your current role. 

Scott 

There is, I mean when clients hire me, there’s a few reasons they want to hire me. Don’t feel like they’ve got cohesion between their executive team. My some some people are off doing one thing, others are doing another. Don’t feel like. Their their vision is necessarily being communicated well and and it really comes down to whether they have a vision or not. So that’s the first thing I look at with them is what is your vision for where you and your team are going together? Because if people don’t understand. And where they need to go, they’re not going to understand what they need to do. Get. It’s as simple as that. And when you have a vision, it’s not, you know, we’re going to do this and this and this. Are goals. Those are tactics along the way. A vision is something that’s. It’s something that maybe you’ll never quite. You’ll always be grasping for it, but it’s something that everybody can understand. And can move in the same direction and. Motivated to get there? So for example, when I was at Ford, the one Ford vision that we had was an exciting and viable Ford delivering profitable growth for all. OK. Well, who doesn’t want to be profitable, right? 

Rachel 

Sign me up. 

Scott 

And and everybody wants to. So it’s not like, well, it’s just going to make management the profit. It’s about spreading it around to everyone, right. Everybody can get behind that. So having that vision is is a real first step. Other is making sure that there’s a consistent culture. That everybody is experiencing and culture is merely a matter of. Of of doing what you say you’re going to do, living up to your your values that you’ve stated and acting in a certain way and telling stories over and over again about what it is that you stand for, what it is that you’re doing, what it is that. Other people to do. Right. And that is a a leaders job is to be the chief communicator for the whole company. If you’re the CEO, 50% of your job should be communication 100%. I said 50%, but I mean I 100% believe. 

Speaker 

Ha ha. 

Scott 

That that you’re 50% of your job should be communication. And and you’re helping other people to take that message and communicate it to their teams as well, which is why it’s essential that that vision and all those values that you talk about need to be easy to understand and easily repeatable. 

Dan 

And the culture is the buy in right. If you think about it, your leadership, the culture is creating these like division and communicating it but getting there by and so that they communicate it in the right way too because if they don’t buy in, you’re going to hard. 

Scott 

And. 

Dan 

Never get it passed your leadership team, right? 

Scott 

That’s it. That’s exactly. Exactly. And. And you can tell when people are bought and when they’re not. And if they’re not. You know what? That’s. It doesn’t mean they’re a bad. It just means maybe they’re not a fit for the organization. Yeah. And ultimately, when you attach all of that to accountability, right, one of the things I do is I’ve adapted Alan Mullally’s working together. Philosophy it’s working. Leadership and management system and and I help clients every week with a a review of their business plan and every single member of the executive team. Has to be accountable. 

Speaker 

They. 

Scott 

Have to be transparent about what they’ve accomplished and what they haven’t right where things aren’t going so well. And in my experience, people are all too willing to. Kind of sweep under the rug the stuff that isn’t going so well and and bottom line is if you can’t, if you can’t talk about that, then you’re never going to be able to fix it. Right. So holding people accountable for the things they’ve said they’re going to do, which again gets back to that character and culture that we’re trying to build. And helping them to deliver on those promises to each other, to their employees and to customers. Then it all starts working together. So it’s it’s more than just setting a culture and it’s more than just having. A weekly set of. It’s about melding the two and people fundamentally understanding what they’re buying into. 

Rachel 

Yeah. And I I think so much of that starts at that top level that executive leadership level because you can. You know, if 50% of the job is communication, which I, you know, totally agree with, there’s another big chunk of that which is, you know, walking the talk, you know, action behind the words that you’re trying to spread throughout in an organization, right. If you don’t see. Culture from the top. Down. It’s so hard to communicate and force and build around that so that you know the whole organization works in the works towards its own. 

Scott 

And ultimately, that that really comes down to honesty and trust and integrity. You know, these are kind of like the backbones of character and character development. And if you break trust with people, then they’re not going to be. As willing to go on this journey with you, if you don’t tell them the truth and they find out you know from a third party or you know in some other way that you lied. To them, well, it just gets at the core of what trust is and you have no integrity after. And those are the kinds of leaders that people like, the ones that are trustworthy and honest and filled with integrity. And I think we need more leaders like that today. More than ever before. And yeah, it’s it’s important to focus on deliverables and profitability and the numbers, but it’s also important to to feed your souls. To understand that without character, all you’ve got is a is a money making machine. 

Speaker 

Yeah. 

Scott 

Without culture, all you’ve got is an assembled group of people who are. Contributing to someone elses wealth, not their own. And and it gets down to you know, what’s inside of you and how you actually share that with the world? 

Dan 

Oh, I was just gonna say is. I don’t think we trust people that are always perfect, right? We know that humans shouldn’t be perfect all the time. If there’s always this facade or this. Culture of we only talk about the good things. We can’t discuss the bad. We always have to moving in this One Direction. You’re not going to find people that are actually committed to you or want to listen to you because we know that’s not realistic and if you. To get that from people. You’ve got to display that first. I mean that goes back to your trust and integrity, but as a leader, it doesn’t mean being perfect all the time. Think in fact it means mainly the opposite, that you can admit when you’re wrong and and look to how to fix it. 

Scott 

Absolutely. I think ironically. This is the Instagram application of leadership, where everything has to be picture perfect. 

Speaker 

Hmm. 

Scott 

And you’ve got all these influencers on Instagram that look like they’re living the best lives, and you peel back a few layers and in some cases, you find out, wow, that’s not actually the case, right? 

Dan 

Right. 

Scott 

There’s there’s a lot of smoke and mirrors and. Filters that go into making them look as good as they do and and you make a great point, Rachel, that the notion of vulnerability has been avoided for so many years from leadership. We expect them to be tough. See so much celebration of, you know, alpha males and winning is everything. Well, we can’t all win all the time and life is filled with failures as well as successes and those who are strong enough to be able to admit failure and obviously to learn from their mistakes. Takes, but to help others learn from those mistakes as. This is one of the things I do in my newsletter. Timeless and timely. Looking back at history, I look at failures of leaders who haven’t done so well, as well as leaders who have succeeded because you want the negative examples as well as the positive examples. Reality is it takes great strength. To be vulnerable, to show your weakness. And it’s again kind of an irony play right there, but those who are able to show where they’re weak, where they’ve needed help from others and what they’ve done to seek that help and to improve. They can help other people do the same thing as well. 

Rachel 

So in your work with with. Leaders with executives trying to help them kind of find this what? What are some tips that you give to maybe some of your clients without revealing everything? But what are some of the tips that you would generally give leaders who are trying to seek that? Ability to be more vulnerable and to kind of tap into that. 

Scott 

Well, ultimately it it comes down to their. Employees wanting to see them as real human beings, you know, as as more than just the boss. I think what we’ve seen over the past four years or so coming out of the pandemic is we’ve seen. One of the things, interestingly, that we tried to do at Fort is we’ve seen more humanization, right? We’ve taken down this this mask that we all we must always be on. Must always be correct. We must always succeed to. Hey. I’m struggling here. You know, I’m just a human. I’m I’m trying to look after a couple of kids and elderly parents at the same time and the sandwich generation for a lot of people. I’m trying to keep medical appointments and attend play recitals and hockey games for my kids and. All kinds of stuff that is just life, right? And this this idea that you have work life balance, what it really is, is this work life integration and. I have seen so many examples of leaders who have struggled. With something as simple as authenticity, how do I be authentic? And for me? Me. It was never a big. It was like, well, I just am who I am, you know, right. But so many leaders. 

Dan 

You just live. 

Scott 

In particular, have been like the office person, and then the home person, and those are two very different personalities. And I work with my clients to help them just live their lives with their employees. To quite frankly. Start with love. Show your employees to care about. Love them up as Alan Mullally used to say to us at 4:00. That’s the first step. 

Speaker 

Itself. 

Scott 

Right. Because if they understand that you care about them and how they are human being. Then they’re going to function really well as employees too. It’s it’s not about just. A whip on them all the time. So I think just starting with that human element first is extremely liberating and helping them to understand that they don’t have to be this suit of armor all the time. 

Rachel 

That’s so impressive in a company like Ford, where you have, you know, how many thousands and thousands of people around the globe to have that, you know, singular leader. There’s a leadership team, but to have that singular leader feel a connection with with each employee throughout. You know the globe that’s such a big undertaking and. I have to imagine just one of the toughest things to learn how to do as a as a leader at that level. 

Speaker 

Well it. 

Scott 

Really has to come from. Yeah, you know, and when it looks like you’re just following a scripted pattern or a a program, people are going to feel the disingenuousness of it. And and again it’s. It’s like honesty and trust and integrity that I mentioned before, when people feel like you’re trying to pull the wool over their eyes. 

Speaker 

Or. 

Scott 

You’re trying to make it seem like you’re something that you’re not. Well, they’re gonna sniff through that and then that’s going to harm you doubly because not only are you not that, but they’re gonna see that you’re. Fraud, right? And if you can’t affect that kind of of empathy and compassion and concern about other people. Well, OK. But again, that’s you doesn’t make you a bad person. Just maybe not a fit for the organization and and and maybe you are a fit for the organization with it. An organization doesn’t care. About having those soft skills that I just talked about, whatever it is, but it’s about being consistent with that culture that you’re. To be in. 

Rachel 

I think. I think there’s so many parallels here that you can draw between the that type of leadership, authenticity and what we see in in communications or marketing. Now you know, I think there’s a lot more you know, outside of the company. Interest or want among consumers to see an authentic face of a brand rather than, you know, obviously your brand is important all the time. But. To have an executive who can speak or to have a conversation with a with a representative who knows what they’re talking. To have more of this face of the brand and put a personality behind that, I think we see so much more of that in communications now also where it’s just. People are craving that they don’t want the, you know, you lose, you lose that credibility quickly, I guess on that front as well. 

Dan 

Well, they know that brands are well, marketing itself is a lot of smoke. Mirrors. I mean you you hear that being picked apart a lot recently? And you’ve used the term smoke and mirrors for leadership, right? It’s exhausting as a person to put on two different sides of you, right? Going to burnout a lot. Marketing is the same way you’re going to burn your audience out real fast if you’re just. Constantly trying to put on this like brand facade of who you are when behind the scenes. There’s a lot more going on, right? Really. You’re right. A lot of parallels there, and that’s why you see so many faces. 

Scott 

Saying it, you know what’s interesting is when I when I first got to. Board, as I said, I was thrown into this carpocalypse Ford and GM and then Chrysler in the fall of 2008 were hauled down in front of Congress because of the whole bailout. Hearings were going on. 

Dan 

Yeah, yeah. 

Scott 

Didn’t need to be there. For the money. But we were there to support. Industry and Ford at the time did not have a Twitter account. Couldn’t get a hold of the Ford handle. And I already had a, you know, modest Twitter. So I just basically got on my own handle as a representative of Ford and talked with people and we continued to take that kind of approach with. A website we put up as we needed to tell the Ford. That was the the name of the website, the Ford Story, and we did videos of our executives. Then I did a the first ever. Twitter Q&A with aceo. Was with Alan Mulally and at every turn what we did was we tried to humanize Ford. And to put real people in touch with consumers and and Alan saw it in an instant, he knew exactly how this was working and the beauty of it was it was consistent with Forde culture and its history because guess what? Henry Ford, who founded the company. Was synonymous with it for its first 40 years, and the Ford family still owns the company and runs the company, and their name is on the logo. 

Speaker 

Yeah. 

Scott 

If all the auto companies, it was the most human, and we actually brought that to light in 2000. 8 umm. Right. And here we are in 2024 now talking about the importance of humanization in communications and marketing. 

Rachel 

Yeah. 

Scott 

It’s all cyclical. 

Rachel 

Yeah. 

Dan 

I would love to have you talk a little bit about your experience across agency, corporate consulting, right? Touched the industry in a lot of different ways and from a lot of different positions. What did you like about each? Did you dislike? Where? Just give us a little bit of the background and and you know from your career how you like to eat. 

Scott 

Well, I think you heard some of my frustrations about agency life already, yeah. 

Dan 

Yeah. Although what a weird time to be an agency. Like I wonder if if it was a different you were trying to innovate, an agency was saying no, I feel like now there’s a lot of innovation in agency and corporate sometimes depending on who they hire can be a little slower. Just an interesting like difference. 

Scott 

There’s, there’s always a back and forth like. You know, we had this shift, I don’t know, maybe about 8 or 10 years ago. Where content teams were brought in house from agencies to in house clients and now clients are trying to cut. Guess. The the pendulum swinging the other way. 

Speaker 

Yeah. 

Scott 

So it’s it’s. The same kind of things just happening in different under different roofs. On the corporate side, I I really enjoyed. Having the freedom to experiment, at least in my position, we were given great license to go out and try new things. Paved the road behind us and we didn’t look to other companies in our industry. Looked at best practices across. All industries and got inspiration from all of them, which was interesting because when Henry Ford did the the the. Assembly. He didn’t look at. He looked at textile manufacturers and he looked at meatpacking. And he kind of put those ideas together and goes, this would work for auto and we can do it this way. That’s exactly what we did when when we were trying to innovate at Ford. So working with some of the most creative. And talented people both on the agency and client side. I would was at Ford was so gratifying. It was something that because all of these people were pulling together in the same direction toward that vision, we just had a great time doing it. Was a lot of hard work. Obviously it was. You know, you’re almost on 24/7, which was exhausting. Don’t miss that part at all. But it but just gratifying that we could make that kind of a. Difference in in people’s lives and you know, moving to consulting and coaching now. I just. I feel like I’m at a time in my life where I’ve learned so much and I want. Give. I want to be able to share what I’ve learned and to teach other people and every newsletter I end with the same phrase and that is. There’s so much to learn. And I truly believe that there is. Am a student for life. I enjoyed my time in the academic world, but I I believe that leadership is about being a lifelong learner. When you’re a lifelong learner, I think you have. A responsibility as far as a leader, to be a lifelong teacher as well. And so for me, being able to impart knowledge, whether I’m discovering it this week or whether I discovered it 20 years ago. Being able to share those stories and help other people along. And kind of not pull the ladder up behind me, but send it down. The elevator back down to help other people come back up. 

Rachel 

And you know, sharing that knowledge you mentioned your. Mentioned your. You also have the the Timeless Leadership Podcast, as well as some others. So. I guess a question for you on. You know, this is inherently a method of sharing knowledge, of gaining knowledge from the people that you speak with. What was, I guess, what was your goal when you first started out with a, with a podcast or with a with a newsletter? How is? Maybe shifted a little bit over the years. There anything that? Is there anything that surprised? That you’ve gotten out of that, that you didn’t expect? 

Scott 

So I started my newsletter probably back in the. Early 2010 SI want to say. Umm. I’m I’ve been blogging forever, but I started a weekly newsletter called I Think was called this week in social media and then I changed it to this week in digital and I had like 8 different sections where I looked at, you know, regulatory developments and. 

Rachel 

Scott 

Changes in the media landscape and marketing and communications and strategy and. And it was a lot for a single person to undertake, at the recommendation of a A. I actually changed the name of that to the Full Monty because there was. There was so much that was that that was involved in it. But I realized as e-mail newsletters became more of a thing and caught up with. Trend that I had identified years before. There were. Armies of people that were putting out daily daily newsletters like this, not even not even weekly. 

Dan 

Oh yeah. 

Scott 

I was like, I can’t compete with that. And while I while it was professionally enriching to be able to stay. Up to speed with what was going. It was exhausting. At the same time, so I decided to turn to. What I what I had been doing say I did a couple of paragraphs at the top of every. I was just kind of like a personal essay and I really enjoyed that part and I got more comments from people on the essay than I did on the 80. Some odd links that I put in the newsletter. And that’s where the value is, right? And that eventually turned into timeless and timely. You know where I realized? OK, I’m. I’m talking about things that are relevant. But we’ve seen years before and there’s, you know, thousands and thousands of stories like this that I can pull on. And. It actually fits more with where I want to go with my consulting practice, which is helping people understand what motivates leaders and how you build cultures and how you do storytelling and all the rest. So it’s. Just kind of naturally evolved over time. But that consistency, you know that that weekly consistency knowing. People knowing what they will expect, what they’ll get every week. Any other topics going to surprise them or? And you know, maybe my writing style horrifies my I don’t know, but I I try to keep. 

Dan 

They’re signed up either way, so. 

Scott 

On their toes and keep. But I try to keep them engaged and signed and and. You know, give them something of value that they can pass on to somebody else in their life as well. 

Dan 

Thinking about that is. Like topic starters or thought. Right. It’s things that interest you and using that, as you know, if you put it out each week thinking like maybe someone will go into a conversation and have something new and interesting to talk about this week because of, you know what I’ve taught them, if you think. About being like a lifelong learner and teacher, I think that’s like a a great point. And a reason to sign up for. You know something I hadn’t thought about reading it. A lot of the times nowadays it’s like, hey, did you see this TikTok on this right? That’s how I tend to start a lot of things, which I would. Really interested in like you being at the dawn of social media, what are your thoughts on like social media today and Tiktok and the brands and the way that we’re using these platforms? 

Scott 

All I can say is I’m sorry. 

Dan 

I’m. Listen, I’ll tell you what about Tiktok, it can say. Say what you will. But I laugh. I cry and I learn a lot. I also have my brain rotted out sometimes. Sure, but there is if you talk about marketing communications content like far and wide, I mean I found so much stuff on TikTok. Go validate it of. But it’s I think it’s a really if if used right, it’s a good platform. 

Scott 

Well, look. Form of media has its value. You know, you just you need to know how to. It and and how to apply yourself. Because it’s so easy, Rachel, to get sucked into that rabbit hole. To to just constantly scroll through. 

Dan 

Yeah. Oh, yeah. 

Scott 

I mean, you’re probably going to develop early onset arthritis in your thumb. 

Dan 

I know, I know. My husband already. He’s already got, like, carpal tunnel and like. Work in medicine. This is. He’s like, I think it’s the phone. 

Speaker 

I think it’s. 

Dan 

I’m like, oh, no, we’re we’re doomed. We’re so doomed. 

Speaker 

Well. 

Scott 

I don’t think there’s any substitute for cracking open a good book there there are. The stories that are, and not just literature, but you know in history there’s so many instances of, like I said, things that we can learn from today that are still relevant today that maybe nobody’s talked about. And this is the thing when I when I saw. This shift at the agency when I was working at Ford, I knew. Talent come in to start working with us. They they they come in thinking that they’ve discovered fire because oh, have you? Have we considered a? There’s this thing called blogging and I’m like, yeah, I think we know about. You know and. 

Speaker 

Yeah, right. 

Scott 

And I think there’s a there’s a, there’s a cultural history that we as communicators and marketers. Are responsible for. We need to tell our own stories and our own history to help the next generation understand how we got to where we are today. And I’ve I’ve said this for. At least a decade and 1/2 that if you look at the evolution of media. When? Radio first started. There were commercials and that’s how he got soap operas. Was soap companies that actually sponsored a lot of these radio dramas? Well, when television came along, they just did radio with. And so the advertising just was OK, we’re going to do the same thing. We’re going to actually put a camera on people. And then the Internet came. It’s like, well, we we know that works. Know we know video advertising works. Know billboards. Let’s just slap those on the Internet. So it’s the same thing over and over and over again. And I can tell you that as we’re looking at threads and I don’t, I don’t know where blue sky is going, but these are platforms that. In some shape or form are going to need to be supported, and if it’s not through advertising then it’s, you know, maybe a subscription model on blue sky. But I can tell you that if threads goes away of Instagram, you’re going to see a lot of ads. So you know, be ready for it. That’s whatever medium is is right for. Just know what its limitations are and know what its strengths are and use it to that effect. 

Dan 

Yeah. Well, there’s something for everyone. Like sub stack right now blowing up with the subscription model and. 

Speaker 

Yeah. 

Dan 

Was just. Watching. Tick tock last night. But it’s this girl who’s a. She’s a recipe Blogger. And so people are saying, you know, how do you make your? People are mad that they’re all moving to sub stack. You’re having to pay for recipes and she said it’s either that or you’re mad that you come to my blog and have to scroll through 17 ads to get to the recipe, right? She’s like, but everyone’s got. Yeah, everyone’s. You know, it’s it’s the end user making the choice of what they would like to pay for. 

Rachel 

Pick your poison. 

Scott 

That’s right. 

Dan 

Their experience is, and so we’re in this age where you can almost have both right now and start to see which one is a consumer you like better. But someone does have to get paid for creating the content, right? Mean that’s. That’s going to remain the same. 

Scott 

But if anything, I think the Nobel Prize in, well, I don’t know if it’s the the Peace Prize or the Nobel Prize in economics should go to the guy that invented the jump to recipe button. 

Dan 

Yes. 

Rachel 

That is a revelation. 

Dan 

You’re so right. I love that. That’s great. 

Rachel 

Well, I I know we’re coming up on on time here, but we’ve got one more question that we like to ask. Kind of close things out. In the interest of lifelong learning and teaching, if you could give your 21 year old self one one bit of advice from your career that you’ve learned, what would, what would you go back and say there? 

Scott 

Oh boy. There’s so much. 

Rachel 

Question. 

Scott 

Well, yeah, just on the. Well, when I think about consuming knowledge. I would tell my 21 year old self. Don’t be afraid to write in the margins. And and that’s both literal and metaphorical, right? I’ve always had always viewed books as these almost sacred objects. They were meant to be handled delicately and read and put back on a shelf. And when I realized overtime is. Books are just another form of media and you can interact with them and and writing down your thoughts in the margins and you go back to a book after a number of years and you can see what your what you had said about it then. And I’ll bet you have a different approach. To things years later, Clifton Fadiman. You know when you re read a classic you. See more. The book than you saw before. You see more in yourself than. Saw before. And I think that is so powerful. As as you reflect on instances in your life and whether it’s, you know, notes you’re taking in a meeting or reflecting on an interaction you had with a colleague afterwards, writing something down and spending time reflecting on it. And and with your thoughts not being afraid to be quiet with your thought. Alright, that’s the temptation of social media, whether it’s Tiktok or Instagram is to keep our mind occupied. We need more quiet. We need more time in the margins with ourselves. With each other. 

Dan 

I like that’s very profound and not something we’ve heard. 

Rachel 

Yeah. What time is no. 

Dan 

I almost feel like a good action of that if we’re looking. Know it’s. We’re coming up on the end of a. Year and people might not like, you know, New Year’s resolutions. But maybe it’s a good time to sit down, you said quiet. Reflect on the year you’ve had, what you think you’ve accomplished, maybe what you would like to accomplish next year? Just evaluate it right? At it. From a bird’s eye view and then come back to it at the end of next year and look at it and see what, how you feel about that then, right? Maybe do it again for that year. But be quiet. Down. Look at your year yourself. Else and and just kind of evaluate it right in the margins and the next year you can write in those margins. Again I like that. 

Scott 

There you go. 

Dan 

Beautiful. Well, Scott, thank you so much for your time and knowledge. Feel like I’ve learned a. I mean, it’s always something to learn and we did it today. 

Speaker 

Dan 

Thank you for spending the time. 

Rachel 

Thanks so much. 

Dan 

We appreciate it. 

Scott 

You’re very welcome and thank you for having me. 

Speaker 

1st. 

Dan 

I could listen to Scott talk all day. 

Rachel 

Yeah. 

Dan 

He’s got the perfect podcast and radio voice, so thanks again to Scott for coming on. Dropping all of that incredible knowledge on us. If I feel like this is really an episode that works for. 

Speaker 

Yes. 

Dan 

Any point in your career, whether it’s school, you’re late in your career early, you are a leader, you aren’t. You want to. There’s Nuggets in here for everybody. 

Rachel 

Yeah, yeah, this is a good one, especially to close the year, like you said at the end of the interview there. This is the time to spend some time in the margins. Love that advice and I think. 

Dan 

I do too. 

Rachel 

Yeah, I think that’s a very, very timely as well. Absolutely. Take some time this holiday season, end of year, getting into the New Year and. 

Dan 

Reflect. 

Rachel 

Look back, reflect, consider what’s next. We’re on a little bit of a different schedule here this month, so this will be our only episode in December, but we will be back in the new Year and back-to-back to normal. 

Dan 

Be back in the New year. We’ll see you then. See you.